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Vince Radice
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Posted: Sat Nov 18th, 2006 06:20 am |
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It has come to my attention that I am being personally attacked by local kite boarders here in the community. I am told that these people who shall remain nameless tell perspective clients of ours that my employee Carlos Pereda and myself are dangerous and reckless instructors. Well I can no longer remain silent on this issue. The people who are attacking me are cowards who simply do not like myself our my shop for their own personal reasons. I will let my simple record stand as a testament to my safety on the water. I have lived in San Carlos for 17 years and have never, that’s right check the record, never had a major accident with any of our clients that I have taken out on the water. I have guided over the years literally thousands of people on diving, kayaking, sailing and fishing trips. Over the last 5 years I have taught dozens of people the sport of kite boarding. Never have any of my students had a major accident. If the people who assassinate my character behind my back really thought I was a danger to people on the beach in San Carlos then they should feel obliged to post this information thus possibly saving the lives of the people I am supposedly endangering. Perhaps they should also speak to the owners of the Paradiso Hotel so that the Paradiso would know the threat I pose to their clients. Perhaps they should inform Lisa at the soggy peso bar the danger I pose to her clients.
These attacks against my staff and myself are not based on facts but simply personal prejudices. I have dozens of people in San Carlos that can vouch for my professionalism in business and safety on the water. I doubt those who attack me could put up the same resume if challenged. If any of you who read this post should hear personal attacks against my shop, Sonoran Sport Center, or my staff in regards to kite boarding safety I hope you will take with a grain of salt the information that is being given to you. It does not reflect the facts of our safety record on the water.
Sincerely Vince Radice
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mexicomelklein
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Posted: Thu Nov 30th, 2006 04:51 pm |
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Bravo Vince! Very well said. You have been an asset to San Carlos for many years and I am sure you will continue.
Keep up the good work!!
MexicoMel
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san carlos kiter
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Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2006 02:00 pm |
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Below is my response to this post. You can see my complete blog at http://kiteboard-mexico.blogspot.com.
In my blog of Nov.16th, http://kiteboard-mexico.blogspot.com/2006/11/still-hasnt-kicked-in.html, I wrote that there was a non-certified instructor showing up at the beach that I said should be avoided, implying that he didn’t follow the current safety guidelines. He replied with a post in the sailing forum that he moderates at http://sancarlosmx.mywowbb.com/forum4/2027.html . He seems to be challenging me to back up what I wrote, even calling me a coward. Well, readers – you be the judge.
He teaches his clients to set up the kite in the self launch position. WRONG
I have observed that Vinny always sets his kite up this way (he is the only one that does) and will leave it up on end while he goes and gets his wetsuit on, etc. He doesn’t even turn the kite down wind; it is constantly attempting to blow away and the only thing that saves it from doing so is that he underinflates the kites and thus are not so apt to try to straighten out. Your kite should be upside down while you set it up and while you get ready.
He then usually shows them how to self launch. WRONG
Beginners should not be self launching; they should be encouraged to always seek out someone knowledgeable to assist. Many beginners have been having rough launches and they need to know that none of us mind giving them a hand to keep everyone safe. If we see you need help, we won’t wait for you to ask – we want a safe beach. Vinny has objected when we try to give advice or help to one of “his” students.
Vinny also has had his students launch on the beach while hooked in and facing away from the sea, towards land. WRONG
Beginners should never hook in until they are getting into the water and should get into the water as soon as possible after launching. It is better to launch towards the water for obvious reasons. Vinny has his beginning students not just hooked in, but he has them putting the kite through the power zone while on the beach in order to be drug down the beach on their heels.
He teaches his students when self rescuing they should attach the bar leash to the board and follow the safety line to the kite. WRONG
The kite can relaunch with this setup and if you are tangled in the lines, you will get hurt, and look out for the board as it flies past you – that happened to me years ago and I will never self rescue that way again. If you don’t know how to do it right – get instructions from someone who does know.
The other day I was telling someone that I really recommend an impact vest harness and Vinny said to him that he doesn’t need the flotation because he will be wearing a wet suit. WRONG
Turns out he had already sold this guy a harness. Well, an impact vest is not for flotation, Vinny, it is to absorb the impact of crashing as the name suggests. Most have very little flotation. Your ribs are very vulnerable. One of our seasonal kiters, Stuart, broke a rib just a few days ago. Last year Ricardo cracked one, Jeff has broken one and Dave Baraff did also. That is just on our beach, where we only have a few kiters.
Vinny sold a 20M kite to a friend that has never tried the sport. WRONG
Oh my God. A 20M kite to use on a beach where the wind howls. Someone sold a 20M kite to a novice on the other side of Mexico and the local kiting community practically called for his head. Read the comments at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/kitesurfmexico/message/6040 (It is in Spanish) I admit that Vinny’s customer weighs more than 70 kgs but this is a kite that can easily get any beginner into trouble.
This is just the major stuff.
My opinions are based on what I have read and watched, and what I have observed on regulated beaches in many locations including major areas such as Cape Cod, South Padre, and Cabarete.
Read the manuals, watch the videos, and take lessons from a certified instructor.
Check out: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xk0ca_ca-fait-mal
I invite comments.
Don
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Vince Radice
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Posted: Sun Dec 3rd, 2006 03:57 pm |
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You are simply wrong on all counts Don. If a friend of mine wants to purchase a 20 meter kite because he plans on kite boarding in light wind then I shouldn't sell it to him or teach him how to use it? You yourself use a 17.5 meter kite. What kind of nut case are you?
As for launching hooked in it is a personal preference, go up to the gorge and watch people launch, they are all hooked in when they launch. With the design of the slingshot gear we use you can be un hooked in a fraction of a second.
If you watched last week when I was teaching Chip he never launched the kite hooked in because I never let him launch the kite. Period end of story. You have a personal grudge against myself and that is why you spew out this buloney. My safety record stands and that is a not personal teaching perference, a beileve or observation, it is a fact. Get a life.
I would also ask people to stay away from Jeff Parker. He is the guy out at the beach that claims he is a kite boarding instructor. He does not have a work visa to work here in Mexico and teaches unsuspecting people kite boarding. He also rips people off by selling them gear that is really not worth the price he charges. Last year he sold two prospective clients of mine a kite for $100 dollars. The kite wasn't worth 30 dollars. Jeff Parker is basically an illegal alien taking business from a legal company with 17years of experience in water sports in San Carlos. He often shows up for his kite boarding lessons smelling of alcohol. He has been banned from even parking his car inside the fence at the Soggy Peso bar run by Lisa. I have looked the other way for years regarding Mr. Paker and the fact that he teaches here and competes with us illegally, but when his buddies and himself assinate our safety record behind our backs I simply can not sit back anymore and take it.
That is a fact not a personal opinion or a lie.
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juanito
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Posted: Mon Dec 4th, 2006 02:08 pm |
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OK. I usually just read this stuff, but, this hits a little too close to home. You guys need need to keep this crap off of forums like this where everybody can see it. People are going to get the wrong impression about all kiters when really it is just a couple guys bickering. We are lucky to have access to the beach in front of the Paradiso property. Let's not give the impression that we are unsafe and could pose a risk to others. If San Carlos continues in it's most recent growth spurt and proposed projects come to be on Algodones, we will have limited or no access to the beach.
Come on! Let's set a good example, be safe and get the stoke back on the beach.
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bartmanaz
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Posted: Mon Dec 4th, 2006 02:44 pm |
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I agree. Don & Vince, it seems to me that rather than snipe at each other, a better approach would be to develop a set of agreed-upon parameters or procedures that everybody can live with and then post those here. Why not get together for coffee or something and work it out? Please....
Bart
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Vince Radice
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Posted: Mon Dec 4th, 2006 03:44 pm |
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Look guys, I never mentioned any names in my first post. Don has made a conscious decision to try to effect my business not based on any facts but personal grudges. I believe his ultimate goal is to try to give business to his good friend Jeff Parker. I have looked the other way for years now on it but people are coming up to me now and telling me what is being said about me. I am on the beach all the time. Don could have walked up to me anytime and spoken to me to my face. This is not what he choose to do and this discussion is not about Kite boarding safety. Now what he recomends, but not in print only verbally, is that you only take kite boarding lessons from a certified instructor named Jeff Parker. The only thing he is careful not to mention is that his buddy doesn't have a work Visa. I spent a lot of time becoming a leagl tax paying business man in San Carlos. I expect if someone wants to compete with me then they should go through the proper channels and get legal. Legal competition is good for the sport and good for business. What Jeff and Don do is counter productive to both.
This is the reality of what is happening here. I think people should know what is really going on here. I believe that is what this forum is all about.
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Miguel
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Posted: Mon Dec 4th, 2006 04:38 pm |
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I disagree with “juanito” and “bartmanaz” -- this is EXACTLY what should be posted on a local forum -- local insight into people and events -- and yes... no matter how “colored” they may be in personal opinion... jeez... we’re all smart enough to separate the bs from clearly laid-out evidence. Taken as a whole... there’s a lot of good information here.
I would like Vince to directly address each of the “WRONGS” listed... his feeble comeback that the poster used a more high-performance kite (17.5 m) than the one he sold to a student not properly skilled (20 m)... AND not directly addressing the wrongs which are documented and backed up by recognized kite-orginizations, is nearly his admission of guilt...
As far as Vinces characterization of Jeff’s instruction... which I take with a grain of salt... his info is still “good info to watch out for.”
If both sides would restrict themselves to “debating” the issue along the line of “san carlos kiter’s” reply post... this thread could never be called “personal” or “sniping.”
My vote is to keep up the discussion... we all learn a lot about the people, their motives, and “skills.” We don’t just need someone to point out all the diamonds... we more desperately need to know where the potholes are... and who may be digging them.
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san carlos kiter
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Posted: Mon Dec 4th, 2006 05:14 pm |
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A few weeks ago at the beach I tried to enter a conversation with Vince about safety and he turned and dismissed what I had to say with “and just who is talking to you?”
This IS about safety. And Jeff is NOT currently working and he IS working on getting his work permit. It is a shame that he cannot work while they process his papers but Vince has threatened to try to have him deported. Jeff is the only certified kiteboarding instructor in town.
I have had people at the beach who know nothing about kiteboarding ask me after watching Vince giving instruction whether what he is doing is safe. Even casual observers can see that his methods are not safe. Yes, I warn people to avoid learning from him. Why does he refuse to learn and teach the accepted safety rules and procedures? The IKO (International Kiteboarding Organization) and PASA (Professional Air Sports Association) have structured safety guidelines for the sport that all kiters should follow. Jeff is PASA certified and is a great source of information and is willing to help out any kiter on the beach, as am I.
In his first post here Vince called me a coward and in his second, a nut case. Too bad these types of comments are allowed on this forum. If anyone wishes to discuss kiting safety with me you know where to find me – at the beach.
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bartmanaz
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Posted: Mon Dec 4th, 2006 05:37 pm |
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Ok, the bottom line is usually the bottom line and this is it-
no more sniping, no more name calling, no more he said, I said....
If the protagonists here want to engage in debate or discussion on proper procedures and kiting safety practices, fine. But the backbiting ends...now!
Bart
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Vince Radice
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Posted: Mon Dec 4th, 2006 11:39 pm |
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OK Miguel, I agree with you so here goes
Don Said:
"He teaches his clients to set up the kite in the self launch position. WRONG
I have observed that Vinny always sets his kite up this way (he is the only one that does) and will leave it up on end while he goes and gets his wetsuit on, etc. He doesn’t even turn the kite down wind; it is constantly attempting to blow away and the only thing that saves it from doing so is that he underinflates the kites and thus are not so apt to try to straighten out. Your kite should be upside down while you set it up and while you get ready."
Vince says: I talk to my students about self launch and tell them when they are good enough if no one is around to help you launch then you can do a self launch. I always tell my students only self launch if there is no one to help you. I do not leave my kite in the self launch position while I go put my wesuit on. When I self launch my kite it is in the self launch position for less than 30 seconds. That the time it takes me to put the lines on the kite and walk down the beach to the bar. I specifically tell my students if you are going to self launch then you can not leave the kite in that position for more than a minute or so. One of the biggest dangers down at the beach are the quad runners who don not pay attention to kite lines and can run right into them. If Don listened to what I was telling my clients he would hear me saying these things. I would imagine it is hard to listen to what someone is saying though when you are a hundred yards away from them and by the way I inflate my kites to the proper PSI. That is why we have a guage on the pump. Now some of my kites might loose a little pressure after a while and especially if you crash the kite in the water your kite PSI may go down a little do to the cold water.
Don Said:
He teaches his students when self rescuing they should attach the bar leash to the board and follow the safety line to the kite. WRONG
The kite can relaunch with this setup and if you are tangled in the lines, you will get hurt, and look out for the board as it flies past you – that happened to me years ago and I will never self rescue that way again. If you don’t know how to do it right – get instructions from someone who does know.
The self rescue technique that I teach as described above is very efficient and the fastest way to get off the water. Don obviously did the procedure wrong probably thus the kite took off again and I bet it was really windy when that happened. It has never happened to me. When begginers self rescue the way I teach it they get back off the water fast with out making a mess of their kite strings. Anyone watching me teach this skill right before thanksgiving would have seen text book self rescues by a begginer who never had not one problem getting back to the beach safely. Apparently what Jeff likes to teach is that you wrap the lines up as you swim to the kite. Try it some time it is no easy task to do. You will probably end up past the houses at Costa del mar before you get out of the water, this method takes a lot of time and energy and in my opinion if you do something wrong with the way you wrap up the lines the kite could get away from you as well and take off. The kite can always get away from you if do any of these techniques wrong. When pulling yourself to the kite you must stay clear of the kite lines and you are off the water in just minutes safely.
Don Says: The other day I was telling someone that I really recommend an impact vest harness and Vinny said to him that he doesn’t need the flotation because he will be wearing a wet suit. WRONG
Turns out he had already sold this guy a harness. Well, an impact vest is not for flotation, Vinny, it is to absorb the impact of crashing as the name suggests. Most have very little flotation. Your ribs are very vulnerable. One of our seasonal kiters, Stuart, broke a rib just a few days ago. Last year Ricardo cracked one, Jeff has broken one and Dave Baraff did also. That is just on our beach, where we only have a few kiters.
Vince says: If you do stupid things you can get hurt. An impact vest does give you added flotation by the way since they are made out of neoprene and if you are going to try to do extreme moves you should wear one. My good friend John who you speak of, who got all of his gear at cost by the way, as the guy who already bought a harness plans on kiteboarding in light air conditions. As I teach all my students by the way is don't kite in big wind as a begginer!!!!! It is highly unlikely that a begginer will break his ribs if he is using his head and does what he is told and kites in light air conditions and lets go of the bar when he crashes so why spend the extra 200 plus dollars on an impact vest if you are going to start out in light winds and not do extreme moves. I would say the majority of people who have kited here have not broken rips and those few who did paid the price and learned a lesson. The other down side of the impact vest is limited mobility, I don't like added weight and restrictiveness of it. But I have never broken a rib either. Some day I may regret my decision to not use one but it is a personal decision not a mandate from a supposed expert.
Don says: Vinny sold a 20M kite to a friend that has never tried the sport. WRONG
Oh my God. A 20M kite to use on a beach where the wind howls.
Vince Says: This comment makes little sense to me. He makes it sound like all I am trying to do is make money off of people and don't care about safey. Here is the reality. My friend Ryan wants to learn how to kite. He approached me and wanted to buy some gear. He is a big guy. He weighs around 200 pounds. If he is going to kite in light air he needs a big kite. I sold him a brand new slingshot Machine 20.5 meter kite package with a carbon bar and pump for $650 dollars!!!! That was my cost on the deal. Ryan plans on learning how to use the kite properly. Don makes it sound like I sold this poor guy a kite and now I am going to send him out in 20 knots of wind so he can kill himself. I will be lending Ryan several smaller kites that he will be learning on before he actually uses the 20.5 meter kite. He will use the kite in light air like the manual says and like I will instruct him.
Don says:A few weeks ago at the beach I tried to enter a conversation with Vince about safety and he turned and dismissed what I had to say with “and just who is talking to you?”
Vince Says: What happened a few weeks ago was this. I had just finished teaching one of my friends from Durango, not a paying customer by the way but still a student and I am still responsable for him, how to self rescue. Chip did a great self rescue just the way I taught him. Now as he is doing a text book self rescue he is in the water by the way actually doing this and Jeff starts yelling at him as he is kite boarding around him and trying to instruct him in something that he has not been trained to do. Now I think that is very unprofessional for a certified kite boarding instructor to yell instructions to someone elses begginer student while sailing around him. Back on the beach I asked Jeff to please enlighten me as to how Chip should be doing a proper self rescue and I was told by Jeff and I quote "Take my kite boarding course and I will teach you". Now that is someone with a definite attitude. Yelling instructions at someone elses student and making that comment. Just then Don walks up and wants to get in my face. I definetly lost my temper my fault completely.
Trying to stick to the facts for you Miguel.
gracias, Vince
P.S.Jeff has been working by the way, he may not be now because I finally posted this info on the forum but he was working during thanksgiving. I spoke to people who took lessons from him.
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Wild Bill
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Posted: Tue Dec 5th, 2006 01:09 pm |
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I second juanitos post.
You guys are sqabbling over turf - turf that isn't yours alone.
Nature has made the beach by the Soggy Peso a great place to kiteboard and it's also probably the best place to teach the sport in the surrounding area. This beach and your passion for kiteboarding brought you guys together. The differences in your personalities put you into conflict. Please put it aside or you will screw it up for everybody.
Lisa, you need to "knock some heads".
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Miguel
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Posted: Tue Dec 5th, 2006 03:27 pm |
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Vince...
very informative -- very educational.
Las mentiras tienen las patas cortas.
(The truth will out.)
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Beachy
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Posted: Wed Dec 6th, 2006 05:53 pm |
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Hi, I've been going to the Soggy Peso Bar often for the past couple of years and have enjoyed watching these guys kiteboard. I've also seen this guy, Vince, do just about exactly what Don says he does and I must admit that his methods look dangerous to a beginner.
However, I also agree with Wild Bill that a lot of this may be more of a turf squabble. Most of the kiters seem to have a great camaraderie going on but Vince is never a part of it.
Can't we all just get along?
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mexicomelklein
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Posted: Wed Dec 6th, 2006 06:51 pm |
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Okay, I give, where is the Soggy Peso bar and how do I get there?
MexicoMel
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JZ
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Posted: Wed Dec 6th, 2006 09:46 pm |
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Algodones Bay, near the Paradiso, to the right of it facing land. Great scallop sashmi (when they have it!).
Last time I was there I saw someone with the kite up on the beach, I was wondering what was keeping them from flying away like in the video posted on this thread.
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Mary
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Posted: Wed Dec 6th, 2006 10:37 pm |
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| I've seen the sign for the Hangout and it fits the description of location. Where is the Soggy Peso in relation to the Hangout? Are they the same?
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JZ
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Posted: Wed Dec 6th, 2006 10:43 pm |
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Same place. They dry the soggy pesos there after you go swimming.
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peg
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Posted: Fri Dec 8th, 2006 01:09 pm |
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| Although I thought that giving kite boarding a try might be fun, after reading all the comments by the protagonists, I think I will just avoid the whole scene.
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KWM
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Posted: Mon Feb 18th, 2008 08:42 pm |
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Well, I will be in San Carlos for a week in March. I just got through reading these responses. I am going to San Carlos to give kiteboarding a try. Do I dare ask peoples opinion on the best way to go about that. I really think you want put a side your dispute figure out a standard that is safe and stop this negative advertising. It doesn't play well for those heading south of the board and want to give KB a try.
Well here goes?
I will be in SC next month. What do you all suggest?
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